Pandora pairing and rewards system really frustrating

Feedback and Suggestions
#1

The actual reward system would be fine if the pairing system worked like the one from heartstone arena (Swiss-system).
Unfortunately, it’s not the case in faeria.

I enjoyed Pandora while i was climbing the ladder (it reminded me HS arena where i’m around 7 wins average per arena), but since i reached my skill level (around rank 5), 70% of my opponents are ranked god and the rest betweeen rank 10 and rank 1.

Once you’ve reached a rank who match your skill level, you will stay at an average 50% winrate, because you will directly meet players with the same skill level of you. There is no curve in the skill of your opponents like there is in a swiss system.
And this is why it’s so frustrating, someone with 50% average winrate at rank 5 (or even at rank god) will win the same rewards as someone with 50% winrate at rank 20 or 25. That’s why the reward system is terrible.

i understand you don’t want to use the swiss-system for pairing (someone with 4 wins and 1 loss will meet someone with 4 wins and 1 loss) because you want pandora to be ranked and competitive, but you can adress the issue by rewarding a win at higher rank better than a win at low rank, for example, in phamtom mode it could be like that :
5g per win while you’re ranked 25 to 21
10g per win while you’re ranked 20 to 16
15g per win while you’re ranked 15 to 11
20g per win while you’re ranked 10 to 6
25g per win while you’re ranked 5 to 1
30g per win while you’re ranked god
and in all cases : + 1 pandora coin if you reach 6 wins.

For pandora mode, you can do something like that :
in all cases :

  • 1 booster
    -amount of gold and memoria based on the amount of wins
    -phantom coin if you reach 5 wins
    -padora coin if you reach 8 wins

based on rank :
if god rank when the pandora run is finish: see the rewards table below :
if rank 5 to 1 see the rewards table below but decrase by 1 the number of wins :
if rank 10 to 6 see the rewards table below but decrase by 2 the number of wins :
if rank 15 to 11 see the rewards table below but decrase by 3 the number of wins :
if rank 20 to 16 see the rewards table below but decrase by 4 the number of wins :
if rank 25 to 21 see the rewards table below but decrase by 5 the number of wins :

rewards table :
1 wins : 1 mythic common card
2 wins : 2 mythic common card
3 wins : 3 mythic common card
4 wins : 1 mythic rare card
5 wins : 1 mythic rare card +1 mythic common card
6 wins : 1 mythic rare card +2 mythic common card
7 wins : 2 mythic rare card
8 wins : 1 mythic epic card
9 wins : 1 mythic epic card + 1 mythic rare card
10 wins : 1 mythic epic card +2 mythic rare card
11 wins : 2 mythic epic card
12 wins : 1 mythic legendary card

for example a rank 13 with 10 wins would have 2 mythic rare cards.

thanks and sorry, english is not my native language.

So I just got wrecked in pandora
What you think about ELO decay and Pandora ranks?
#2

I agree with F6H.
At the moment, it’s better to intentionnally lose the phantom mode and try to rush 12 wins with pandora coin again worst players.

But for me, the swiss-system is the better (and delete the rank in pandora mode).

#3

Thanks for your well constructed feedback. :rubyfish:

Pandora’s ranking and reward continue to be areas we will be improving on in the future.

For the record, the matchmaking algorithm does use a current run’s win/loss rate as a factor when finding an opponent.

#4

Agree with Zebabas, players can misuse the ranking system by losing intentionally in Phantom mode, that you get at least once a day, and get a lower rating and sealclub noobs.

The ranking system can be fixed easily.

Option one; separate rating for Phantom mode and Pandora normal mode.
This way Pandora will always be the ranking of the actual players unless someone wastes a lot of gold coins in order to lose games and get a lower ranking. Phantom mode can still be misused by pro players, but the rewards aren’t that great to cause an issue.

Option two; Phantom mode is based on both Phantom ranking and normal Pandora ranking, Pandora has its own ranking system.
This way normal Pandora mode cant be misused by players just like the first option, and neither can the Phantom mode since its tied to the general level of player skill. If the player loses phantom runs on purpose it will only slightly lower the Phantom mode ranking and not the normal Pandora mode

Back to the OP post, I have to agree that the better a player is, the less the potential rewards are because of the rankings, and the idea for rewards given above is a pretty good example.

Another option is to make Phantom coin games Ranked, and Pandora Unranked, or both unranked.
This way you always have a chance to get rewarded according to how well you play since you encounter every type of player, however this might lower the games in Pandora by less good players, so to compensate it might be an idea to add once more loss to the game mode to scale this.

I might come up with more/better ideas later, but I hope this helps or at least fuels some other ideas.

#5

It’s not true (or it doesn’t work properly) because I play two battles in a row with same person very often.

#6

The matchmaking algorithm cares about many things, one of which is matching current win/loss. That doesn’t mean it will always make an ideal matchup, because it is also trying to minimize queue time for all players.

#7

Since I’m rank10, I never play again a rank more than 12.
For me, the main things to matchmaking is the rank. And the best idea to have 12 win is to chain loose intentionally in phantom mode…

Another option is to make Phantom coin games Ranked, and Pandora Unranked, or both unranked.

Very good idea (both unraked is good)

#8

With 10 wins (I finish Level 11), I got:

117 Gold
24 Faeria
1 Pandora Coin
1 Azure Wisp (rare) mythic
1 Booster

It’s normal?

#9

with 11 wins and 12 wins, i had the same rewards as you exept an epic mythic card instead of a rare, i guess your reward are correct.
no changes in pandora rewards had occur since my post.

#10

I agree with topic creator, draft modes are diffrent than ranked queue. Your goal is to maximize reward and in current situation it force you to do things that are not entertaining (like intentionaly losing games) and think around matchmaking instead of focusing on gameplay and draft only. There is also issue with first win od the day and winstreaks (which push you into higher winratio than you should have).

To sum up system in which players even think about lossing on purpose to gain some advantage can’t be good.

As i came here as heartstone arena player (with avg of 7.8 wins per run) i hope devs will adress this issues.
I put great hope in this game and pandora mode.

Cheers :slight_smile:!

#11

Is this actually rigth? I achieve a 12-0 (I’m God rank *13) and I won an mythic epic card… So how can I win a mythic legendary?

#12

You have the highest chance to win a Mythic Legendary at 12 wins, but it is not guaranteed. I believe you are guaranteed an Epic, however.

#13

It should be, then. It’s a really big gap between a mythic legend and a mythic epic, considering the first gives you 100 memoria, the latter 400 for disenchanting. If you want a mythic legendary, you even need 1600, for an epic 400. That’s, depending on what you want, 1200 memoria difference for the same amount of wins. :unamused:
So what else do you get? A big bunch of gold (like 300?), 1 or 2 packs (=essentially another 100-200g), a coin (=another 250 gold value) and a random amount of memoria.

If you consider 12 wins are too few to guarantee a mythic legendary, this is fine with me. Just higher the maximum amount of wins to 13, 14 or 15. Should be rare enough to reward a guaranteed mythic legend. :wink: